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Poll Would you like escrow on ectunnel? (1 Viewer)

Should we have escrow on ectunnel?


  • Total voters
    15

Redbot

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Further question:
What should the escrow options look like?

I have no interest or time to personally run a middle man service, but I bet I can find some folks who'd be interested in offering such a thing, if there's demand.

What are some issues escrow providers run into, and what can we do to help? I imagine escrow on P99 and other emu servers can be difficult.
 
Last edited:

hustlin123

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Im guessing something like that has a fee attached to it, much like playerauctions?
Personally I don't like those added fee's, mind you i am a Seller and would make most buyers eat the fee.
In my opinion this would be in favor of the sellers but not so much the buyers.
If I had the extra time and could operate 24/7 I would offer to do so, but this is not the case.
I am curious how others feel on the subject though!

Hustlin,
 

Redbot

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Im guessing something like that has a fee attached to it, much like playerauctions?
Personally I don't like those added fee's, mind you i am a Seller and would make most buyers eat the fee.
In my opinion this would be in favor of the sellers but not so much the buyers.
If I had the extra time and could operate 24/7 I would offer to do so, but this is not the case.
My current idea is to allow users who are verified & pass an extra check provide escrow services, so there'd be a market to keep fees reasonable.

This is all optional of course. I've been getting messages about our old middleman service, i don't want to provide it but i bet some people do.
 
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bractos45

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Random thoughts in regards to this...

I consider (and know) myself to be an absolute honest, and reputable seller here on ECT.

I'd think that payments should be handled by something other than PayPal, as anyone sending money (whether FnF or not) can easily charge-back the cash they've sent. This is a big part of the reason I quit using Middle-man services to begin with. It's great having someone else to verify accounts, and / or hold Kronos until payment is made to protect the buyer.. but, the sellers risks are still easily a factor as once everything is verified / kept on a 3rd party, the buyer still sends cash directly to the sellers cash account.

I dislike PA for various reasons, but, the one thing I did like (before I found ECT) is the middle-man disbursement method that they use. Hold / Verify someones payment for a few days until it "clears the system" then disburse the cash to the seller. I've thought about throwing in my chips to offer the middle-man services if able and / or allowed, but, if some shady buyer wants to pull the funds back to his account, now myself, the middle-man, is held responsible for that charge-back and not the seller. I've even done some reading into changing my PayPal into a business account to help prevent things from going astray. Although the more I read on this the answer I get from PayPal is still the same, charge-back via Banks is ultimately out of their hands.

I'm not sure if Venmo or some app that's similar offers a bit more protection for the seller, but now-a-days, even FnF isn't all that great.

The other issue I've thought about when it comes to MM services, that I've mentioned somewhere here before, is it seems most orders here are for Kronos. Which means a huge difference between ordering $9.50 per Krono, or $10.00. Purchase 10 of the $9.50 Krono and you're only saving about $5 compared to the guy whose charging $10 per, but that $5 makes the world of difference in which seller the buyer ultimately chooses to go for. For high-priced accounts, sure, an extra $5 - $10 per sale wouldn't make that much difference to a buyer, but it still offers nothing for the seller in terms of protection.

My solution is that I've thought about it before and can't come up with a clear-cut way to make it legitimately safer for both the buyer, and the seller.. unless there was a way to completely prevent charge-backs to the seller, the buyer still has ultimate protection or control over the sale.
 

bractos45

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Another idea i've considered might help for the buyers, is within the "Thread-Posting" section (Where you select what you're selling, what server, how many, races / classes / SQA etc...) is adding in the price right then and there. So if you want to make a post for an account that you're charging $300+ for, with no feedback / account was made the same-day, is have some sort of verification where you at least need to submit some sort of information to make it not-so-completely- anonymous. IE: that Zerkerguy account who showed up posting like 5 - 6 accounts for $300 - $600, then immediately scammed his first customer. That not only gives a bad name to every other new legitimate seller, but also a bad name to ECT as a whole as i'm sure repeat business for people that have been in that situation would be next to impossible. I think having to select a price within the site would make the difference between someone new trying to sell 5 Kronos for $9 a pop, or someone whose brand new trying to sell multiple accounts for hundreds of dollars.
 

Teichou

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Random thoughts in regards to this...

I consider (and know) myself to be an absolute honest, and reputable seller here on ECT.

I'd think that payments should be handled by something other than PayPal, as anyone sending money (whether FnF or not) can easily charge-back the cash they've sent. This is a big part of the reason I quit using Middle-man services to begin with. It's great having someone else to verify accounts, and / or hold Kronos until payment is made to protect the buyer.. but, the sellers risks are still easily a factor as once everything is verified / kept on a 3rd party, the buyer still sends cash directly to the sellers cash account.

I dislike PA for various reasons, but, the one thing I did like (before I found ECT) is the middle-man disbursement method that they use. Hold / Verify someones payment for a few days until it "clears the system" then disburse the cash to the seller. I've thought about throwing in my chips to offer the middle-man services if able and / or allowed, but, if some shady buyer wants to pull the funds back to his account, now myself, the middle-man, is held responsible for that charge-back and not the seller. I've even done some reading into changing my PayPal into a business account to help prevent things from going astray. Although the more I read on this the answer I get from PayPal is still the same, charge-back via Banks is ultimately out of their hands.

I'm not sure if Venmo or some app that's similar offers a bit more protection for the seller, but now-a-days, even FnF isn't all that great.

The other issue I've thought about when it comes to MM services, that I've mentioned somewhere here before, is it seems most orders here are for Kronos. Which means a huge difference between ordering $9.50 per Krono, or $10.00. Purchase 10 of the $9.50 Krono and you're only saving about $5 compared to the guy whose charging $10 per, but that $5 makes the world of difference in which seller the buyer ultimately chooses to go for. For high-priced accounts, sure, an extra $5 - $10 per sale wouldn't make that much difference to a buyer, but it still offers nothing for the seller in terms of protection.

My solution is that I've thought about it before and can't come up with a clear-cut way to make it legitimately safer for both the buyer, and the seller.. unless there was a way to completely prevent charge-backs to the seller, the buyer still has ultimate protection or control over the sale.

how do you charge back on fnf?
 

drunkmonkz

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In 2015, someone did a full reversal of $250 that they sent by claiming they fat fingered the email address or that the incorrect address was given by a family member. It's very difficult to have it happen, but it CAN happen.

I did a fraud claim when my cursed account got hacked and someone donated 300 dollars to some random russian stream via my paypal credit. They put a limit on my account for 180 days after that, so I feel like the same thing would apply.
 

Redbot

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Since it's clear that an escrow provider will be taking on risk, I believe they should be prepared to lose money on a deal, as well as provide some insurance to both buyer and seller.
 

Agnew1990

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I think so. This will save a lot of time. Be willing to pay for insurance.
Everyone has very busy hours. There is no time to reply to messages when you are very busy. That has led to a mass exodus of buyers. And so on.
 

bractos45

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Without going into too many details here (I’ll message you Teich). It’s very easy to do and PayPal offers no protection against it.
 

Redbot

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Would anyone here like to be the first to offer an escrow service?

We're looking for someone who is online at least twice a day. You set the rate (flat rate, % of sale, etc.), you keep the $. As usual, ECT doesn't cut in on your business.

You can set your own terms (e.g. both members must be premium, seller must be verified with 5+ feedback, etc) and you can set your insurance terms (trades guaranteed up to $200, etc.) If you're a long-time trusted member here, send me a PM and we'll run a complimentary background check and get started.
 
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bractos45

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I'd definitely consider it if I had more time to spend in my office!!!! Best of luck!!!
 
S

Spiken

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only way i can see this work is with bitcoin.
Paypal is way to easy to chargeback on even with FnF, the middle man dude will mostly always lose, since he takes the risk and then he is sitting there without money or an account
 

Redbot

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Here's how I imagine a typical escrow transaction would occur. This is only my recommendation and isn't set in stone, an escrow provider can create their own methods that work best for the server(s) they're supporting.
  • A transaction is created between the buyer and seller.
  • An escrow provider is chosen by one of the parties, and the escrow provider is invited to a group conversation
  • Before the exchange can start, the buyer or seller have to pay the escrow provider a fee. (fee is determined by the escrow provider)
  • The seller will then transfer the item or account to the escrow provider.
  • The escrow provider will update the password and fully re-secure the account.
  • The buyer will then send payment directly to the seller using any payment method both parties agree to.
  • The seller then confirms to the escrow provider payment was received.
  • The escrow provider will then release the item or account to the buyer and help them re-secure it.
 

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